Theodore Hamm talks about his latest book, Run Zohran Run! Inside Zohran Mamdani’s Sensational Campaign to Become New York City’s First Democratic Socialist Mayor, an inside look at how Mamdani’s bold, grassroots campaign toppled New York’s political establishment and delivered the city’s most progressive mayoral primary victory. The author will also assess the state of the election campaign after incumbent NYC Mayor Eric Adams ended his campaign on Sept. 28.
THEODORE HAMM: Good to be with you.
SCOTT HARRIS: And yeah, we’re really happy to talk about your new book that provides in-depth coverage of Zohran Mamdani’s Democratic primary win in June that nobody expected, right? And it was really a virtual earthquake inside New York City politics. So congratulations on this book. And I first wanted to ask you how and when you decided to take on this writing project. Did you have a sense early on in the primary campaign that Zohran Mamdani’s campaign that was what, 8 percent way back before the June vote actually occurred—did you have a sense that Zohran Mamdani was capable of shaking up the political status quo in New York City and it was important for you to document this?
THEODORE HAMM: Sure. So back in March, the publisher of OR Books, Colin Robinson and I, we met and we were discussing the campaign and we were excited to see a socialist doing well for the first time in recent memory in New York. And we saw that he was getting traction and likely to get at least, I don’t know, 100,000 first place votes. So we didn’t think he was going to win, but we thought the book would be useful in terms of just analyzing the building blocks for future campaigns—what did work and what didn’t work and so on. But then as things progressed throughout the spring, it just appeared that he was really catching fire and that made it an exciting time to be writing the book, but it made it a little bit stressful to try to get it out by this fall. So it’s already out via the OR Books website, so it’s available.
SCOTT HARRIS: That’s great. And I know certainly depending on what happens in this race in November, you’ll be updating the book with results of the election, I’m sure, right?
THEODORE HAMM: I am working on that round two. I submitted some of that this morning, so it’s about keeping busy.
SCOTT HARRIS: For our listeners who don’t know, tell us about Zohran Mamdani’s unique story as a leading Muslim, South Asian mayoral candidate likely to win being born in Uganda and growing up in South Africa. I believe he came to the U.S. when he was seven years old and went back and forth to South Africa, but he certainly got for a leading candidate in America’s largest city—he’s got a very unique place.
THEODORE HAMM: Sure. So yes, you’re correct. He came when he was seven, that would have been the fall of 1999 when he was just about to turn eight, his birthday’s in October. His father Mahmood Mamdani is an internationally known scholar of anti-colonialism, movements against colonialism in Africa and elsewhere. And his mother’s an internationally acclaimed Hollywood film director, Mira Nair. So he comes from an influential family in terms of the arts and politics and so on.
But he grew up as a faculty kid, I guess you could say in Morningside Heights near the Columbia campus and went to Bronx Science, which is one of the elite public high schools in the city. He was an athlete, he loved to be a captain of the soccer team. He helped start a cricket club playing against other teams that were made up of members of the South Asian diaspora, Trinidadians, Guyanese and so on throughout the city.
So I described some of his youth based on the interviews I conducted with him in late March and early April. So he had such a wide-ranging experience, amount of experience in his youth that he could tap into a lot of different aspects of the broader population in New York City. He grew up upper middle class, you could say certainly and he would agree to that. But he also understood that working people want to stay in the city—themes that he has been stressing throughout his campaign. One of his first jobs was as a foreclosure prevention counselor in Queens. And so he was helping people, homeowners address the crises they faced in trying to terms of staying in their homes. So he mentions that, I quote him in the book saying that’s a through line of his work— this home—trying to keep people in place in their homes is something that he has a particular attachment to.
SCOTT HARRIS: The big news from Sunday, yesterday, Sept. 28, was that incumbent New York Mayor Eric Adams has ended his campaign turning what was a four-way race into a three-way race now between Mamdani, former New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo and Republican candidate and Guardian Angels founder Curtis Sliwa. Does Adams dropping out in your view, change the fundamentals in who will likely win in the November election? And what role, if any, do you think President Trump may have had in convincing Adams to end his campaign? Given that I get that it was just a couple of weeks ago, there was open discussion in the Trump administration of making Adams U.S. ambassador to Saudi Arabia if he chose to drop out as these guys are so transactional.
THEODORE HAMM: Sure. Well, it’s a bit of a mystery because as you said, there were these rumors that he would maybe get a position at HUD. That was another rumor too, right? So then there was a Saudi Arabia ambassadorship, and there were other real estate positions within the real estate world that were being floated around. And then he ended up what we heard yesterday, and there hasn’t been any reporting I’ve seen thus far that shows exactly what he may have received in return for stepping aside or saying he won’t continue his run, suspending his campaign.
So I just don’t know that it’s going to make that much of a difference. I mean, if the polls are accurate, Cuomo trailed Mamdani by 20 points prior to Adams dropping out, but Adams only was scoring 10 percent or so in the polls. So even if, let’s say all of those voters for Adams migrated to Cuomo, you’d still be 10 points behind. I’m just using these rough numbers. But then the question is, do Adams’ voters, do they all like Cuomo? And I don’t think that’s the case. I think some may even end up liking Mamdani because they’re Democrats. Some may like Sliwa because he’s been around and he’s got his appeal in certain ways to old-time New Yorkers, and some may just sit it out. So I don’t think it’s a game changer in that respect.
SCOTT HARRIS: Mamdani’s affordability message amid the skyrocketing cost of living in New York City, and of course everywhere across the country—that was especially true after COVID and still true now after Trump’s tariffs. Do you think that Mamdani’s popularity in New York City signals where U.S. politics may be going in the near future?
THEODORE HAMM: I think that would ideally be the case. Sure. I mean, I think you have to sort of apply the themes he’s addressing of affordability to various local circumstances. New York is so much more expensive than most places in the United States that you’d have to sort of see what would work in places in the Midwest or wherever it might be.
But with that theme in mind, so bread and butter issues (are) something that the Democrats certainly should focus on and they didn’t focus on in the 2024 election. They simply played lip service to the problems of inflation. And so one of the first things Mamdani did that put him on the map was go to neighborhoods in the Bronx and Queens that had voted seemingly there had been a swing towards Trump in those working class areas, Little Bangladesh and northern Jamaica, Queens, for example. And he talked to voters and that really, they told him what their issues were and how the Democrats didn’t offer anything and so many sat it out. Some voted for Trump and so on, right? And some raised issues like Palestine and things like that. So the Democrats weren’t really addressing people’s needs in terms of directly in terms of affordability. And Mamdani certainly tapped into that. Certainly saw that when he walked the streets of those neighborhoods where there was a distinct swing towards Trump in 2024.
SCOTT HARRIS: I wanted to talk about your chapter in the book “Sticks and Stones,” where you discuss the smear campaign against Mamdani, especially from Rupert Murdoch’s tabloid newspaper, the New York Post. Tell us about the attempt to discredit Momani related to a lot of things, but of course, him being a democratic socialist, a Muslim, and a very vocal opponent of Israel’s war in Gaza, the starvation and the mass slaughter there. Certainly he’s said things that people quote all the time and say, “Oh, this guy, he’s bringing the jihad or whatever crazy thing that they associate with him.” But tell us about the smear campaign, how coordinated it was and in the end, it appears ineffective.
THEODORE HAMM: Sure. So in 2021, the New York Post was instrumental in electing Eric Adams or helping Eric Adams get elected. And I also mentioned the New York Times was influential in their endorsement in 2021 of a candidate, Catherine Garcia, she came in a close second. So they both thought both of those outlets thought they could flex their muscles, flex their power, but the way it played out was different than either one expected. In terms of the Post, I mean, they either love or hate most public figures, right? And so obviously anyone to the left—they don’t even like Cuomo, right? Because they see him as caving as governor. They saw him caved in what they, in their view, caving to the left on certain issues and so on. But they definitely don’t like a socialist. They’re very strongly pro-Israel and they thought they could just beat up on the guy and call him names and so on, and that they could smear him with a red brush and make him portray him as an antisemite, even though he was simply critical of Israel, he has never said anything that would qualify as anti-Semitic, right?
But they stretched that, they treated any criticism of Israel as antisemitic, and they weren’t the only ones doing that. This was their powerful forces. The people going after Columbia University like Bill Ackman and so on, they were funding campaigns throughout New York City council campaigns that had very little to do with Israel, Gaza or Israel-Palestine and so on. But they just were so strident in their views, trying to crush any criticism of Israel, but it ended up backfiring. So I think with the case of the Post, people just sort of ignored, tuned it out after a while when they’re just relentlessly smearing someone. And the Times was doing it in the Times fashion, but it was more high-minded, perhaps, not as direct name calling, but they were going after him, too. So I think in some respects, that backfired generally speaking in that people said, “Well, if these powerful institutions are trying to crush this guy, well, maybe there’s something this guy’s doing that’s a good thing for the masses, right? So the standing up to the bullies …
SCOTT HARRIS: Absolutely.
THEODORE HAMM: ... plays well. Yeah.
SCOTT HARRIS: The New York Democratic Socialists of America chapter was a powerhouse in this campaign. Were they organized in the primary to get out the vote operation that recruited tens of thousands of volunteers that knocked on one-and-a-half million doors? I mean, it’s incredible. And of course, that made a decisive difference in Mamdani’s stunning victory in June. Tell us about DSA and the role it will play in the November election and how significant a player you think DSA will be in New York City politics going forward.
THEODORE HAMM: Well, this actually connects to what we were just discussing with the New York Post, because right after Oct. 7 Hamas attacks in Israel, the New York Post went after the New York City DSA saying that they were helping recruit people to a rally at Times Square, where some random person flashed a swastika and so on. And that just led to smears linking the New York City DSA to the person with the swastika and so on. And they were trying to go wipe them out essentially. And instead, Zohran and other elected New York City DSA members stood their ground and continued to voice their criticisms of Israel and advocate for people in Gaza and so on. And they gained by standing on the ground, they gained traction. And then Zohran launched his run a year later in October of 2024 and the tide increasingly changed in terms of public opinion about Gaza to the point whereby the primary in June of 2025 and the public opinion at least among Democrat. was strongly pro-Palestine, right?
So they were at the forefront of that and the NYC DSA. And so that put them on solid footing with the broader electorate. And now, yeah, I think yes, as you mentioned, they helped organize the volunteers, brought out the huge numbers of people. But not all, by no means were all members of the New York City DSA. It was only 6,600 members when the campaign started back in October of 2024. So they were recruiting from other groups. There were East Asian organizers, a group called Kave that works with South Asian populations or communities in the city called Drum Beats and so on. So I read about these various groups that worked in conjunction with the New York City DSA. Jewish Voice for Peace is another one. So large networks of activists joined together, but it was led by the NYC DSA. And they’re already mobilizing mass canvassing for the fall election and they post these pictures with hundreds of people in various neighborhoods going out on the weekends.
And so they’ve ramped it up considerably in advance of Nov. 4th, and I think they stand a very good chance. There’s a strong chance, a very good chance of winning. And the NYC DSA now will have a lot of influence in terms of other races, candidates for other offices and so on.
I think they’ll have plenty of connections to his administration. He’s expressed open support. When Bernie Sanders was at Brooklyn College for an event with Zohran, he talked up the NYC DSA and said, “Go to the lobby. They are tabling out there. Join the group if you have concerns about childcare and things like that.” So he hasn’t renounced his support in any way. I think he’s sent out recruiting statements and so on. So I think they’ll play an integral role in his administration, should he take office on Jan. 1st.
SCOTT HARRIS: So Mamdani’s popular campaign pledges include taxing the richest 1 percent, rent free free buses, universal childcare, which is crazy expensive. And some city-run grocery stores where there’s food deserts.
And of course, those policies aren’t very popular among the city’s wealthy elite and the Wall Street powerbrokers in New York City. How hard will they be fighting to defeat Mamdani in November? Not saying they can or they will, but they may put some money into this effort. And if Mamdani wins, how difficult will it be to win passage of his ambitious agenda? And I’ll just mention, I have a friend who lives in Manhattan, and she’s all in on Mamdani. She was knocking on lots of doors, very excited, but wasn’t sure he was going to win, but said, “Man, I almost hope he doesn’t win. They’re going to have, there’s going to be hell to pay if he wins in terms of the opposition forces that will be gathered to defeat his agenda.” I mean, that’s the way she felt before the primary. I’m sure she’s jazzed up now, but yeah. What’s your prediction about the hell, the hellscape that will be laid out for Mamdani if he wins?
THEODORE HAMM: Well, there’s many different scenarios, but there was just some reporting today that the various business leaders in the city forecast it’s likely that he will win. And so they’re coming to terms with that, right? Better for them to maintain access to City Hall, than be an outspoken foe of City Hall if there’s things they want from the city. So there’s different ways, depends on which particularly powerful interest. You have to sort of break ’em down, like those that Israel is their main number one issue. Sure, they’re going to continue to hammer away and try to undercut Mamdani. Those that are more interested, the powerful forces that are more interested in simply maintaining the successful business enterprises and the various kinds in the city. It’s not in their interest to try to create chaos in the city. They need their executives to go to work and the city to function as best it can.
And so I don’t think anything he’s really proposing is that threatening, right? It seems like it’s what people who are really angry with him, they’re trying to snuff out the bad example—what they see as a bad example. So they think democratic socialism will catch hold. If it does well in New York City, then it will be mirrored or mimicked across the United States and other parts of the world, and that’s not what they want. They want capitalism, unfettered capitalism because it serves their interests. So it’s an ideological struggle. I guess I can hide behind the fact that I’m not I’m a historian, I’m a journalist. I don’t like to predict the future so much. Anything’s possible.
SCOTT HARRIS: Especially these days. We see what’s going on every day in the news. Just a final question. Democratic House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries and the Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, they’re both from New York, but they’ve withheld their endorsement of Mamdani. What do you think this indicates about the contradictions within the Democratic party today in the face of Trump authoritarianism, fascism, military forces in our cities and the consequences for the party’s future that this attractive, very appealing and popular guy in New York City, the largest city in the country, and the top Democrats are saying, “Huh? So what?”
THEODORE HAMM: Yeah, thanks a lot, Scott. Happy to come back and chat anytime.
SCOTT HARRIS: That’s great. Thanks. Goodnight.
