It’s been four years since Donald Trump incited the violent Jan. 6 insurrection at the U.S. Capitol that resulted in the deaths of several people and injured over 140 police officers. As the twice-impeached former president, convicted of 24 felony crimes and found liable for sexual assault takes office on Jan. 20, he’s pledged to pardon some or all of the 1,270 men and women convicted of crimes related to the Jan. 6 attack on Congress that was organized to stop the peaceful transfer of power to Joe Biden, the winner of the 2020 election.
Among the Jan. 6th defendants who may be pardoned are Proud Boys leader Enrique Tarrio and Oath Keepers founder Stewart Rhodes, both found guilty of seditious conspiracy and other charges related to the breach of the U.S. Capitol. Tarrio received the longest sentence among those convicted for Jan. 6th crimes — 22 years in prison — while Rhodes received a sentence of 18 years.
Between The Lines’ Scott Harris spoke with Public Citizen’s Democracy Campaign Co-Director Jonah Minkoff-Zern, who condemns Trump’s campaign pledge to pardon convicted Jan. 6 insurrectionists that was described in the group’s recent press release as a betrayal of the American people. He’ll also examine the consequences of these pardons on the rule of law and the dangerous signal it will send to right-wing domestic terrorists.
JONAH MINKOFF-ZERN: Trump campaigned on the idea that he would make American people safer. And one of his first action that he says he’s going to pardon these actors who who violently attacked the Capitol, violently attacked police and in an organized way, in a planned way. And that ranges from people who are in prison for decades for planning the attack, to people who took extraordinarily egregious actions of violent actions against police officers who are speaking out and saying they are deeply disturbed by the idea that these people could be pardoned and that Trump would betray them in that way.
And I think it’s really notable also important to note, that they were acting basically in the name of Trump. But more than in the name of Trump, but that Trump worked to build up to this point — that he committed a series of actions that led to their violent attack on the Capitol. And really was at the root of why it happened.
SCOTT HARRIS: Jonah, a lot of people looking at this promised pardon of these Jan. 6 insurrectionists as really the bottom line is it’s an endorsement of domestic terrorism. There’s a lot of concern that Trump’s pardon will give a green light to right-wing extremists who embrace political violence to make changes they can’t achieve through the democratic process or other peaceful means.
Groups like the Oath Keepers and the Proud Boys, whose members were convicted of seditious conspiracy, are among those wanting a pardon. You’ve got the leader of the Oath Keepers, Stewart Rhodes. He was sentenced to 18 years in prison for seditious conspiracy, as was Enrique Tarrio, the Proud Boys leader. He was sentenced to 22 years in prison.
If Trump pardons these Jan. 6th insurrectionists? Is it not a green light for domestic terrorism in our future?
JONAH MINKOFF-ZERN: I think if he does, we have to see and make it clear that this is a violation of his promise to make us safer. If, as a first act of president, he’s pardoning people who are convicted of violent crimes and of organizing an attack on the Capitol, an attack on these police officers — if that’s his first action, then we have to say or counter the point. And I think again and again, we have to note that he is violating his promises that he’s made to the American people. And this would be the first one and a major one.
I also think it’s really important to note and we just did a press event with two of the Capitol Police officers who were attacked. They pointed out that any actions, that any crimes that these people take in Donald Trump’s hands, that anything they do or that people do in their names if they’re pardoned, that Donald Trump is directly accountable for those actions. And we have to make sure that’s very clear. And I think it’s really important that the media play that role in drawing that connection that that Trump is directly accountable for any criminal activity that these people take or their organizations take, as you said, if they feel empowered by his actions.
And I think that’s why Vance’s trying to talk this back and walk this back right now. And again, it’s why our organizing to make a difference on this and many other things over the coming years.
SCOTT HARRIS: Jonah, I did want to ask you about some concern out there concurrently with Trump’s promised pardons of the Jan. 6h insurrectionists. There’s also concern that that Trump and his new directors of the FBI and the Department of Justice will drop investigations and monitoring of right-wing extremist and armed groups and militias that use violence and intimidation to achieve their political goals.
These groups may be let loose to harass or terrorize any individual or group that Donald Trump declares his enemy. I think that’s a legitimate concern and I’m wondering what you’re thinking about where the Department of Justice and FBI may be headed in terms of the dangers that these right-wing extremists and armed violent groups present to the country.
JONAH MINKOFF-ZERN: I think we need to be vigilant. And I think, you know, like any other issue that, that their willingness to do that depends on how we respond. So showing the attacks, making clear what they’re doing, making clear that connection to Trump and his administration, if they happen, those are the things that are going to push them back.
So I think we have our power is showing the truth, showing what’s happening and drawing those connections to the actions of Trump. And that’s what’s going to stop things from getting bad. And that’s what’s going to keep our democracy intact and also give us a chance to lay out a vision for what we want for America.
Listen to Scott Harris’ in-depth interview with Jonah Minkoff-Zern (27:25) and see more articles and opinion pieces in the Related Links section of this page.
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